Who Are the Bible’s 144,000

Who Are the 144,000 of Revelation?People001 group 144

                                             – by Mary A. LaClair

Widow friend

Widow friend

It was bad weather on a Sunday afternoon and I called a widow friend to pass a little indoor time pleasantly. Although this lady claims to be a no-nap person, she was so grumpy I figured my call must have caught her in a cat nap she didn’t want to admit.

The next day she left an apology for her grumpiness on my woman sadanswering machine. When I got back to her, she explained her bad attitude that day had been with God, not with me. Whew, God is better able to handle bad attitudes than I when we give them to Him, He handles enough of mine; He can handle hers!  And He did! I know this lady has kept her faith through some tough times, some of which she talks about and some of which she doesn’t. She explained that she had been reading Revelation and had developed an attitude with God because it appears that she would not be included in the 144,000 mentioned there. And it certainly seems a final tribulation has begun she said!

woman sad-happyI explained that as a lady myself, I too had a similar feeling when I read that the 144,000 were all males but that I asked God and He explained it to me.

I showed her, as God has shown me, where there are two groups mentioned; the 144,000 being one group, a Jewish countable group; while the other group, the multitude from every nation, was too large to count and had white robes washed in the Blood of Christ. THIS is the group, I told her, in which she and I (and I hope you, too, dear reader) are numbered. It is the great multitude group which speaks of salvation and of the Lamb. Salvation comes through Jesus, the Lamb of God. “These are they who have come out of the great tribulation; they have washed their robes and made them white in the Blood of the Lamb.” THIS is the group which comes out of a great tribulation which seems to begin when the Power of the Blood becomes available. Because the Blood of Christ is a qualifier for the group too large to number but not for the 144,000 – the 144,000 number was necessarily filled before the Blood of Christ, BEFORE Calvary. To confirm, Rev 7:9 says AFTER the 144,000 came those who washed their robes in the Blood of Christ.Book_of_Revelation029

Redeemed before a great tribulation began, these 144,000 are explicitly sinless Jewish males; and since Jesus Christ is and always will be, the only perfect sinless man, these males then could not have reached manhood when they were redeemed from among men (from the earth). There were no childhood lies (yes, they count), they have a language all their own; and, they follow the Lamb wherever He goes. Does that should like innocent little ones to you?

Because Revelation says these 144,000 were first fruits unto God and first fruits unto the Lamb, I figure there were two segments making up this group. Since God and the Lamb are the same, there is a significance to the use of the two words: one group from the Old Testament (were God is introduced) and one group from the New Testament (where the Lamb is introduced in the Flesh) thus we have the significance of “unto God and unto the Lamb”.

First fruits unto God would be, relative to history, just before Moses was given The Ten Commandments, the first fruits unto God being slain when Moses was a baby; baby moses the first fruits unto the Lamb would be, relative to history, just before Jesus completed His mission, when Jesus was a baby. These are the first fruits unto the Lamb.baby Jesus Nativity_Scenes011

A lot of Bible reading grand-mothers have known for years that these 144,000 are the Holy Innocents. God would not let Pharaoh and Herod slaughter innocent Jewish male babes only to forget them. He forgets not His own. They are especially honored in Heaven just as they are honored and menrioned specially in Revelation.

Some say there is a final tribulation contained within the great tribulation and is expected to last seven years. I believe we each have our own personal tribulation from which we should all eventually seek relief given by the Risen Christ, and ask Him to be with us in this life through His Holy Spirit.

Yes!

Yes!

I hope my friend will begin to ask God about things which she does not understand instead of assuming and getting grumpy. In Isaiah 1:18 God instructs us: “Come now, let us reason together, says the Lord.”Without quoting it here, Revelation 7:1-17, the whole chapter, introduces the number and the source of these Jewish males.

Revelation chapter 14 identifies them in more detail:

 14 “Then I looked, and lo, on Mount Zion stood the Lamb, and with him a hundred and forty-four thousand who had his name and his Father’s name written on their foreheads. 2 And I heard a voice from heaven like the sound of many waters and like the sound of loud thunder; the voice I heard was like the sound of harpers playing on their harps, 3 and they sing a new song before the throne and before the four living creatures and before the elders. No one could learn that song except the hundred and forty-four thousand who had been redeemed from the earth. 4 It is these who have not defiled themselves with women, for they are chaste;[a] it is these who follow the Lamb wherever he goes; these have been redeemed from mankind as first fruits for God and the Lamb, 5 and in their mouth no lie was found, for they are spotless.”  Angels018

6 “Then I saw another angel flying in midheaven, with an eternal gospel to proclaim to those who dwell on earth, to every nation and tribe and tongue and people;…” Revelation 14:1-6 (RSV) (emphasis mine)

The 144,000 are already dwelling in Heaven with the Lamb before the gospel is proclaimed to those who dwell on earth. The 144,000 are already there.

Conclusion: The timetable in Revelation may be further ahead than a lot of people think. Don’t think that there is plenty of time to repent while waiting for 144,000 perfect Jewish men to come upon the world scene.  They have already come and gone.

Friend, have you come to Calvary to wash your robes in the Blood and Water which flowed from the Savior’s side? Will you be included in the group from every nation, too great to number, which are saved from within the great tribulation? Do not delay to come to the Savior today. Investigate Jesus, the Christ.

Please wait for animated messages to load before going on…you will like the three of them below

Jesus died for whoever animatedYes!                                                                                                                                                       Jesus love never dies animated   gospel animated rotating verses

Angels018                         –  end –

A MAN NEEDS TO KNOW A WOMAN’S PLACE IN GOD

A MAN SHOULD KNOW A WOMAN’S PLACE IN GOD

— by Mary A. LaClair

Concerning a column titled “A Woman Should Know Her Place'(in God), (under the Helium Website category: Should Wives Still Submit To Their Husbands)http://www.helium.com/items/1094700-womans-place—in-society-in-church I have had some input. Some did not understand what lesson they were to get from the reference to Bible passages in chapter 13 of the Book of Judges.

This is the chapter which deals with Samson’s mother and foretells the birth of Samson. God brought the message to the woman. Manoah’s wife was out tending the garden gardeningwhen the Angel of God appeared to her. She took the message from God to her husband. The husband, not wanting to believe a woman, even his wife, prayed that the Angel would come again, this time to both of them. God came again, but came to only the woman again, when the man was not there.

If there is there a message here it is ‘why do you doubt your wife?’

Feeling the husband would need to see for himself, the wife fetched him while the Lord graciously waited. When the man asked further instructions of the Angel, the Angel replied, (my paraphrase) just do what I told your wife!’ However several versions say “Be sure she follows all the instructions I gave to her”.

Wow! Did that man feel put out! Now, it was he who was under orders to follow his judge gavel and biblewife’s instructions!

If a preacher today preached this message he’d probably be thrown out of a lot of churches; yet, this message of mutual submission is from God, and God never changes. Mutual submission and mutual respect are all over the New Testament; this message even being in the book of Judges in the Old Testament. Lest some think women were messengers concerning only the birth of a child, remember the risen Jesus appeared first to Mary Magdelene with the instructions, “Go tell the brothers that I have risen!”

One person thought the earlier column should be named Man Should Know Woman’s Place With God. I agree!

There is a lesson to be learned there. No more of this business that a wife is wrong because of Eve. Lessons on Adam and Eve would cover five pages but before I get offpalmtree animated on a rabbit trail, Adam could be faulted for not telling Eve of God’s message properly, for in Gen 2:15-21 it is only Adam who is given the command not to eat of the tree, and Eve wasn’t created until after this. Is it any wonder God decided to trust women with more messages? Many women prophets and even a woman Judge are exemplified in the Old Testament. Let today’s women not follow Adam’s inadequate message delivering concerning God’s commands!

Returning to the story of Samson’s mother – If Manoah had been working alongside his wife he probably would have been there. Yes, I’d say the Lord likes togetherness and garden old man and womanGodly agreement between mates. He certainly instructed it in this account ; yet, did not honor mutual submission in the deceptive agreement between mates in the account of Annanias and Sapphria; such was met with death, death on an individual basis (Acts 5).

Further interesting reading regarding this topic may be found at: http://looklistenthink.wordpress.com/2011/01/30/boss-or-leader/  and

http://looklistenthink.wordpress.com/2011/11/25/consenting-adults/

If a man dares hold submission over a woman’s head, then it is both the man and the woman who should know woman’s place with God, and with the position of women in Christian culture. Further, it is my personal opinion that God will use women mightily in these last days! Selah!

women seen and heard

For further reading relating to this topic you may wish to see:

https://theproverbs120column.wordpress.com/2013/03/16/what-did-jesus-write-in-the-sand/

SHOULD WOMEN SPEAK IN CHURCH

WOMEN SPEAKING IN CHURCH    by  Mary A. LaClair      women mouth taped

The Corinthian church was seriously lacking in order and chapters 11-14 of First Corinhians deal with conducting an orderly meeting. In chapter 14 it tells women not to interrupt the service. The passage below addresses two issues for conduct of public worship: (1) women who speak and prophesy with authority and(2) women who interrupt to ask questions. See if you can pick out where each is addressed in this Scripture:

“1 Corinthians 11
New Living Translation (NLT)
‘11 1 And you should imitate me, just as I imitate Christ.
Instructions for Public Worship
“2 I am so glad that you always keep me in your thoughts, and that you are following the teachings I passed on to you. 3 But there is one thing I want you to know: The head of every man is Christ, the head of woman is man, and the head of Christ is God.[a] 4 A man dishonors his head[b] if he covers his head while praying or prophesying. 5 But a woman dishonors her head[c] if she prays or prophesies” —(in public worship)— “without a covering on her head, for this is the same as shaving her head. 6 Yes, if she refuses to wear a head covering, she should cut off all her hair! But since it is shameful for a woman to have her hair cut or her head shaved, she should wear a covering.[d’]”

There seems to be no doubt that this portion is dealing with public worship gatherings and some Bibles even include the heading to this part of the chapter as INSTRUCTIONS FOR PUBLIC WORSHIP ie. NIV; CEV, NLT (as above)
It’s possible to get caught up in the word picture of hats and head coverings that the picture of women speaking and prophesying in church is missed by many. What this is saying is that it’s taken for granted for women to naturally pray and prophesy in public worship, and thus instructions on properly doing so.

???????????????????????????????????????ladies old fashion hats

Conversing with a Pastor, I offered to speak in his church on the principle of tithing. I was told I could speak only to the ladies Bible study; but I would not be invited to speak to the church as a whole. That particular church interpreted 1 Corinthians 14:34-35 “Let women remain silent and ask their husbands when they get home ” (my paraphrase) as actually saying women were not to speak in church at all which Scripture will prove a mis-interpretation.
Scripture says it this way:

34 women should remain silent in the churches. They are not allowed to speak, but must be in submission, as the Law says. 35 If they want to inquire about something, they should ask their own husbands at home; for it is disgraceful for a woman to speak in the church. 1 Cor 14:34 35(from New International Version)

The New King James puts it this way:

34 Let your women keep silent in the churches, for they are not permitted to speak; but they are to be submissive, as the law also says.35 And if they want to learn something, let them ask their own husbands at home; for it is shameful for women to speak in church. 1 Cor 14:34 35NKJV emphasis mine

When this Scripture was written, women sat on one side of the church and men on the other side. Asking a question of their husbands meant calling out across the room. One will note that chapter 14 of 1 Corinthians is addressed to an unruly church where everyone was speaking at once.

No matter which version is used; verse 35 explains verse 34. It means, “don’t interrupt a service or a teaching to ask a question”. It specifically addresses women asking questions during a service. Speaking and interrupting are two different things. women at podiumwomen w blaring megaphone at manEvery once in awhile I get serious about dogging God until He explains a particular Scripture to me. I feel I have some insight as to how and why that Scripture came about, and I got my answer from secular television. Yes, it’s true! And it’s not the first time God directed me to TV for an answer. One time He told me I’d find my answer on that night’s weather forecast! And I did! That’s another article.

Additionally a lot of our TV sit-coms feature loud over-bearing women with a Brooklyn accent.

The fictional characters of the Seinfeld and the Costanza mothers on the famous sit-com , are not portrayals of a general quiet female character.

I can just hear a Fran Dresher-type woman at an Old Testament prayer meeting call out to her husband, speaking without permission “Hey, Sam, what does that mean….. ?”, followed by laughter. While I’m not picking on anyone here, TV does admit this type of woman exists, else where would be the relational comedy ?

In addition, some Mediterranean people groups are known for their large outgoing Mamas’ who don’t mind either being loud; or, feigning ignorance for the sake of the male. Hmmmm….so…

…it definitely could be that this Scripture was written for a certain type of woman, in a certain situation, and not for all women in general. I think it was NOT written for the soft spoken contemplative wife of 1st Peter 3:4 5…

4 “Instead, it should be that of your inner self, the unfading beauty of a gentle and quiet spirit, which is of great worth in God’s sight. 5 For this is the way the holy women of the past who put their hope in God used to make themselves beautiful.” NIV

There is a difference between speaking and interrupting. To be in submission here means not to interrupt. To make that one Scripture an example for all women is comparable to relating female comedienne’s to all women. Not so!

I wish to thank the TV producers, and the actresses who accept these roles, for having given me what I feel is insight into this Scripture!

And I thank God for women preachers like Joyce Meyer, Marilyn Hickey, Beth Moore, etc. etc. and am grateful that Diana Hagee is given the pulpit on occasion, also. women at podium                            Yes!

Proverbs 1:20 still holds true!

Prov 1:20

20 Wisdom calls aloud in the street,

she raises her voice in the public squares; (NIV)

The Spirit of Wisdom, in Scripture, is always in the female gender – – that’s woman!

Prov 1:20 21 from the Revised Standard:

20 Wisdom cries aloud in the street;

in the markets she raises her voice;

21 on the top of the walls she cries out;

at the entrance of the city gates she speaks: RSV

Proverbs 8:1-4 “Does not wisdom call out? Does not understanding raise her voice? 2 On the heights along the way, where the paths meet, she takes her stand; 3 beside the gates leading into the city, at the entrances, she cries aloud: 4 “To you, O men, I call out; I raise my voice to all mankind.” (from New International Version)

There is a difference between speaking and interrupting. To be in submission here means not to interrupt. To make that one Scripture an example for all women is comparable to relating female comedienne’s to all women. Not so!

1 Corinthians 11:4-5 says that when women pray and prophesy in church that she should have her head covered:

“Every man who prays or prophesies with his head covered dishonors his head. But every woman who prays or prophesies with her head uncovered dishonors her head—it is the same as having her head shaved.”  (NIV)

This certainly admits that men do not have exclusionary rights when it comes to speaking in church, or even prophesying in church — for Holy Scripture says that when women do prophesy in church, they should wear a ‘hat’ or a scarf. And that is women speaking in church!

They should speak with their wisdom as God intends.

Further reading relating to this topic is found at:
https://theproverbs120column.wordpress.com/category/women-and-church/men-need-to-know-womens-place-with-god/ AND AT
http://www.helium.com/items/1094700-womans-place—in-society-in-church

Thanks for reading and contemplating the whole of God’s word on this subject.